Those wounded Ferguson police

I’m sorry the two Ferguson policemen were shot (one of them in the face), but even more sorry that the issue of police killings has turned from a problem many agreed needed solving to an Hussein Obama-Al Sharpton controversy. I agree the latter have made things worse, but that’s all you could really expect from them.

It’s simply past time for police across the country to begin training on how to subdue people who are resisting arrest without killing them. Then there’d have been no Ferguson rioting and probably these two wounded officers would not be. Keep up the police killings of recent years and there’ll be more shootings of police. Ipso facto.

UPDATE:  Or perhaps better yet, as JAY352 says in the comments here: the bar on use of force needs to be raised.

12 responses to “Those wounded Ferguson police

  1. Reblogged this on Eatgrueldog and commented:
    Ambivalent…

    • Thanks for the link. It’s not just an angry black (or Sharpton-clown) thing, law-abiding middle class whites increasingly are afraid of the police and with good reason.

      • No we have a serious police state problem.This is a blue issue, not black or white. It is not only deadly force, but the use of force period. The bar needs to be lifted (Think Eric Garner) for the initiation of any force.

  2. I can’t think about anything that would have helped the cop in Ferguson (Darren Wilson) to stop that 292-pound guy short of the gun. But you are right, there are a lot of borderline cases.

    • Pepper spray, Taser, flipping a switch inside the car setting off a VERY loud siren… Those are just three that come to mind. There are ways short of slaying. And it’s up to the police to find them and use them.

  3. I think neither of these officers was a Ferguson officer. One was a Webster Groves (very nice, upscale, college town south [?] of Ferguson) officer, the other was a County officer. I have noticed the current narrative about brutal cops really started after the survey in which the nation’s police, by a vast majority, came out for 2nd Amendment Rights. They weren’t supposed to do that. I think the media have been doing their best to drive a wedge between police and the public ever since. So, if a case shows up, or doesn’t really, it is really publicized and pushed.
    The Brown shooting had nothing to do with resisting arrest, everything to do with a lethal attack on the officer. The officer was well trained enough to survive; if he wouldn’t have, there wouldn’t have been riots, true enough.
    Garner was resisting arrest and was swarmed, just about the safest way to take a resisting person into custody,if enough people are available. He wasn’t choked out, and could breathe or he would not have been able to say anything. He had been arrested many times before for the same offense. He was the only one there who knew what his physical condition was, except perhaps, for his wife, if she was there.
    Mace when it was tried, was mostly ineffective. Likewise the “stun” guns seldom worked (often just made the subject more angry) and were soon abandoned. OC was much more effective, but not on everyone and takes time and space (and proper wind direction) to use, but it was a great advance. Tasers are great, but once again, takes time and space and just doesn’t work on some people. It is clothing, mental status and body composition dependent, and relies on two electrodes sticking correctly.
    Police have been trying and training to arrest non-compliant subjects without harm for many years with mostly great success. But there is a difference between handling a person resisting arrest and protecting oneself from assault, primarily involving the amount and kind of force the resisting subject uses. Since the decision making time is very compressed, and very crucial (with no backs) to the individuals involved, there are going to be borderline cases after a week or so of review, despite anyone’s wishes. It is mostly driven by the arrestee’s decisions, which have to be responded to, very quickly.
    Police brutality dramatically dropped in the early to middle eighties from earlier times and is still dropping.
    Come up with a phaser that is set to stun that works, and today’s police will be grateful.
    My vote is with JD.

  4. One thing for sure, the entire argument should not rise or fall on the details of Garner or Brown, much less Trayvon. There are many other cases worth considering, such as Miriam Carey and the black man in Austin whose name I forget. He ran from a Hispanic cop who wanted to question him and he was shot in the back and killed. No crime other than running which the law defines as “resisting” arrest. The cop in that is awaiting trial. I agree with Jay352. The threshold for use of force needs to be raised. And clearly defined for all to see and understand.

  5. I am not sure about any bar getting raised, other than Tooter’s, But I’ll tell you what, if I’m a cop and I feel like I have to shoot to save me or anyone else, I’m shooting. When it comes down to them or us, I know what side I’m on.

    I’m not pro-cop, Lord knows. If we want people to respect and obey the police, then we need to get rid of laws that would prevent, say, guys like Garner for selling single cigarettes. Stupid laws breed stupid enforcement.

  6. Ah, but stupid laws keep stupid pols on the gravy train. And it may be fair to say that primary among those stupid laws is one designed by your favorite (;-) president. Nixon, going against the advice of his own handpicked drug commission, chose to outlaw the sale and use of marijuana. Enforcement of which, alone, has given us the largest prison population in the world.

  7. It would be neat if about three quarters (or more) of the laws were eliminated and what remained was simplified, with a good knowledge of the remaining laws taught repeatedly to the populace as a whole and agreed to, as a whole. So that, really, ignorance of the law would not be an excuse, for the citizen Or the government.
    Another gift of the sixties was the substitution of the law for morality and social mores.
    But along with a real cure for cancer and/or heart disease, and development of a free energy source, the result would be whole industries disappearing.
    And so much for that.

  8. Then, too, the other cases are not part of the Narrative, where Garner and Brown are, for whatever the reason. The two most egregious cases are out West, Las Vegas and another area. They drew no interest whatsoever. On the other hand, the small number of cases noted, on a nation-wide or State-wide basis, are usually already in violation of current standards, if the news stories are to be believed.

  9. Lest we forget: the adolescent playing with the realistic-looking but nevertheless toy pistol in a Cleveland park who was shot dead by a cop. Cop’s version: kid menaced him with the pistol. Kid not available for comment. Why no outcry? I have no idea. I appreciate the comments, guys, but I must return to my original conclusion: “Keep up the police killings of recent years and there’ll be more shootings of police. Ipso facto.”